# The Trouble with Trunk Roads **URL:** \ **Category:** Support\ **Created:** [December 9, 2020, 2:34pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023 "2020-12-09T14:34:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/itsafrogslife/32/1467_2.png) [@itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/u/itsafrogslife)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2020, 2:34pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/1 "2020-12-09T14:34:54Z")
I was wondering why some of the main roads in Liverpool weren’t appearing in the list of completed or uncompleted streets. When I looked on OSM I saw they are all added as Trunk Roads and that the ‘Allowed Access’ field has ‘Foot’ = ‘Not Specified’ (by default?). I guess that’s because you can’t assume that a trunk road has a footpath. What it means, however, is that I’m going to have to do a hell of a lot of editing to change the acccess to “Foot” = “Yes” for all those roads I know are most definitely runable using a path or pavement. Has anyone else found the same? ![Screenshot 2020-12-09 at 14.24.01](https://d25dflut6m8e53.cloudfront.net/original/2X/e/eafa07f280cf730a339f94ae9993be718cc79351.jpeg) ![Screenshot 2020-12-09 at 14.24.18](https://d25dflut6m8e53.cloudfront.net/original/2X/6/619d3f67882048f8a1e84eda3a35b01ba0eecbf1.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![ericjrw](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/ericjrw/32/1065_2.png) [@ericjrw](https://community.citystrides.com/u/ericjrw)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2020, 4:11pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/2 "2020-12-09T16:11:21Z")
I wonder if OSM allows for scripted, i.e automated (perhaps via SQL) edits? Might be a question for the Slack group - [osmus.slack.com](http://osmus.slack.com) ---
**Author:** ![mcoleman38](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/mcoleman38/32/1681_2.png) [@mcoleman38](https://community.citystrides.com/u/mcoleman38)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2020, 7:30pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/3 "2020-12-09T19:30:18Z")
Hi Graham, this entry [About the Node, Street, and City Data](https://community.citystrides.com/t/about-the-node-street-and-city-data/19802) has a section on streets and in there you’ll find a link to a description of the query that is used to determine what to include from the OSM data. Checking that out will tell you what it is about certain roads that is leading to them not being included. ---
**Author:** ![8f7162110d9eeaf907ab](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/8/ad7895/32.png) [@8f7162110d9eeaf907ab](https://community.citystrides.com/u/8f7162110d9eeaf907ab)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2020, 9:08pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/4 "2020-12-09T21:08:55Z")
Trunk roads are excluded via the query since in most countries these are “car only” type roads. The UK has all A roads mapped as highway = trunk (see here [https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dtrunk](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dtrunk)), which includes roads that go pretty deep into cities like the one from your example. Unless the query is altered, changing the foot permissions won’t make a difference so not much point going down that route, unfortunately. The “good” news is that it’s not _that_ many streets: [overpass turbo](https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/111l) ---
**Author:** ![itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/itsafrogslife/32/1467_2.png) [@itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/u/itsafrogslife)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2020, 5:19pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/5 "2020-12-10T17:19:55Z")
Thanks for the info. Unfortunately in Liverpool the “good” news isn’t that good for me given that there are quite a few trunk roads, including those in the city centre on my screenshot and Queens Drive ring road which has housing along the majority of its length. I’m going to run them all anyway (why wouldn’t I?), it’s just a shame they’re not counted on CS. ---
**Author:** ![ian](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/ian/32/434_2.png) [@ian](https://community.citystrides.com/u/ian)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2021, 7:17pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/6 "2021-04-06T19:17:08Z")
Hi @JamesChevalier, I’m afraid that this is not correct: > The UK has all A roads mapped as highway = trunk Per the link you gave, only `primary A road (green signs)` are tagged as such. Many UK trunk roads in the UK are very much not ‘car only’. [This](https://www.google.com/maps/@53.6654514,-1.4432232,3a,75.5y,266.79h,82.24t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1shKo1eZHGFhylFI7qKu6yFA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DhKo1eZHGFhylFI7qKu6yFA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D306.93088%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192) is a few hundred metres from my house: ![image](https://d25dflut6m8e53.cloudfront.net/original/2X/b/bde4b936b6823df116c0d4f58377615a6bd83b6a.jpeg) Is tagged as trunk on OSM (rightly per the guidelines) but is most definitely runnable, it has a pavement/sidewalk on one side. Could the import query not be modified to include roads like this please? ---
**Author:** ![itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/itsafrogslife/32/1467_2.png) [@itsafrogslife](https://community.citystrides.com/u/itsafrogslife)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2021, 9:01pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/7 "2021-04-06T21:01:23Z")
I would very much like this! ---
**Author:** ![m\_l\_heywood](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/m_l_heywood/32/2073_2.png) [@m\_l\_heywood](https://community.citystrides.com/u/m_l_heywood)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2021, 9:09pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/8 "2021-04-06T21:09:46Z")
Its a difficult one this. I had the opposite issue recently where a mapping site I was using was insisting on using a dual carriageway as is was foot=Not Specified so I had to switch this road to foot=no to get sensible route suggestions. Therefore, simply switching on trunk roads may give too many false positives. Would the solution therfore be to allow trunk roads but exclude foot=not specified? Would need to do the work suggested earlier in the thread to update OSM to be foot=yes but that feels the “right” solution to me. As examples, both correctly tagged as Trunk in OSM ![20210406_221601](https://d25dflut6m8e53.cloudfront.net/original/2X/6/646e854e01a6afe66f7013febd46eeb4f9840b66.jpeg) foot=no as I have updated as no paths ![20210406_221617](https://d25dflut6m8e53.cloudfront.net/original/2X/a/a656edab712b7a4cd988a05a69dc9e8cc7bfc650.jpeg) currently foot=not specified but footpaths both sides of the road (if I ever go for a run when back over at parents would update this to foot=yes) ---
**Author:** ![missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/missiejacobson/32/2542_2.png) [@missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/u/missiejacobson)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2022, 10:08pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/9 "2022-05-18T22:08:35Z")
I mentioned something in a different post and I wanted to post in here. In the US alot of trunk roads are completely runable and used for cyclist. I live in Minnesota and there is a project to change tons of roads to “Trunk” some of these go right threw a small town but some go threw big cities and are just a normal street with sidewalks. Where I live the road even changes names as it goes threw my town. I have already ran a bunch of these and will continue. I find it unfair that we dont get credit for certain streets because some of them are safe and some are unsafe. I think trunk roads should be included and if its an unsafe area then it should be marked as foot “no”. ---
**Author:** ![missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/missiejacobson/32/2542_2.png) [@missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/u/missiejacobson)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2022, 2:25am UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/10 "2022-06-09T02:25:37Z")
@JamesChevalier its been a few weeks. I wanted to check in and see if you have considered the change of trunk roads. ---
**Author:** ![ktarullo](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/k/9fc348/32.png) [@ktarullo](https://community.citystrides.com/u/ktarullo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 10:30pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/11 "2023-02-02T22:30:14Z")
@JamesChevalier is there any opportunity to review the status of **Trunk Roads**? They are excluded from from the Overpass Query, but as many have expressed, most all Trunks are runnable in the US and UK [Erie Boulevard](https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/44159861#map=17/42.81730/-73.94080) and possibly even allow **Primary Roads** [Delmar Bypass](https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/67967938#map=16/42.6065/-73.8305) By disallowing them, the privilege of having them count is completely removed from our control. To allow them would allow the local folks to proceed to change them to _foot=no_ ---
**Author:** ![JamesChevalier](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/jameschevalier/32/2_2.png) [@JamesChevalier](https://community.citystrides.com/u/JamesChevalier)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 7:46pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/12 "2023-09-01T19:46:47Z")
Going back through my list of unresolved topics & came to this one… It does look like Overpass supports a form of ‘or’ query: [overpass turbo](https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/1zHs) I don’t _really_ know what I’m doing in Overpass 😬 😅 but fiddling around with parenthesis in their Wizard showed me something similar, so I’m _guessing_ it’s a solid usable query. I basically duplicated the way/node sections inside the parenthesis, modifying the second one a bit to only look for trunk roads (`['highway' = 'trunk']`) that are specifically marked as ok for foot traffic (`['foot' = 'yes']`) … the rest of the way/node details are the same, since those seem like they’d still be valid. It’s _really_ tough to navigate the resulting map (panning doesn’t work for me, but zooming does). I was able to confirm that [Way: ‪Walton Hall Avenue‬ (‪546637441‬) | OpenStreetMap](https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/546637441) appears in the modified query and does _not_ appear in the original one. And it does seem like a good addition when reviewing in [Google Maps](https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4465977,-2.9474415,3a,75y,232.82h,83.67t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s2wWLo4hcIweRvFsdQlw_uA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D2wWLo4hcIweRvFsdQlw_uA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D337.441%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu) So this could be solvable by allowing highway=trunk _only if_ foot=yes I’d _really_ like to hear more people’s perspective on this, but this seems like a decently safe change. ---
**Author:** ![missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/missiejacobson/32/2542_2.png) [@missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/u/missiejacobson)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 3:28am UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/13 "2023-09-02T03:28:58Z")
I know i would seriously love to see Trunk roads with foot yes turned on! I have tons of roads i have run and they dont count. Minnesota project that was done turned a bunch of roads off. And rhey run threw cities with sidewalks. Example here > **[Way: ‪Nelson Boulevard‬ (‪59173894‬) | OpenStreetMap](https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/59173894)** > > OpenStreetMap is a map of the world, created by people like you and free to use under an open license. ---
**Author:** ![hans1](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/h/e68b1a/32.png) [@hans1](https://community.citystrides.com/u/hans1)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 9:18am UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/14 "2023-09-02T09:18:44Z")
Sounds like a very good solution! ---
**Author:** ![missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/missiejacobson/32/2542_2.png) [@missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/u/missiejacobson)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2023, 1:06pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/15 "2023-09-07T13:06:39Z")
So does is trunk roads going to get added back in? ---
**Author:** ![missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/user_avatar/community.citystrides.com/missiejacobson/32/2542_2.png) [@missiejacobson](https://community.citystrides.com/u/missiejacobson)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2024, 11:59pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/16 "2024-02-04T23:59:27Z")
@JamesChevalier since its been several months i thought I would check in on this. I know it would be nic3 to get credit for all the trunk roads I have ran and many others seemed to feel that way too. ---
**Author:** ![nicholas.kollett](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/dfb087/32.png) [@nicholas.kollett](https://community.citystrides.com/u/nicholas.kollett)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 4:27am UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/17 "2025-01-06T04:27:46Z")
@JamesChevalier, Wanted to bring this back up. I like your solution and it seems others did. Can you implement this? You could possibly also add Expressway=yes to filter out of CityStrides. ---
**Author:** ![msikkema](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/3ab097/32.png) [@msikkema](https://community.citystrides.com/u/msikkema)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 5:39pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/18 "2025-01-06T17:39:28Z")
I cautiously support including Trunk roads, provided those of us who edit OSM include “pedestrian=NO” to areas of the roads when it’s appropriate. While there are some Trunks that are fairly safe-to-run, there are some very dangerous Trunk roads/sections out there. No sidewalks, small shoulders, fast moving vehicles, etc. Actually I think the same editing (pedestrian=NO) should be done to some Primary roads too. I’m surprised by some highway-like roadways classified as a Primary roads on OSM. ---
**Author:** ![die\_go](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@die\_go](https://community.citystrides.com/u/die_go)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 10:11pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/19 "2025-01-06T22:11:13Z")
Here’s what the [OpenStreetMap wiki’s Key:access page](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:access) says: > Access tags pre-eminently describe **legal** permissions/restrictions and should follow ground truth, such as signage combined with legal regulation, rather than guesswork. They do not describe common or typical use, even if the signage is generally ignored. The way I see it, access tags in OpenStreetMap should not be based on judgments about safety/appropriateness. ---
**Author:** ![msikkema](https://community.citystrides.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/3ab097/32.png) [@msikkema](https://community.citystrides.com/u/msikkema)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 11:42pm UTC](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023/20 "2025-01-06T23:42:40Z")
Agree about not editing roadway access based on your own judgement, however pedestrian access is limited on certain roadways. And it’s limited for safety reasons, not because it’s physically impossible to go on them. All I’m saying is if Trunks are to be included, which I think should be, we should consider the safety aspects. Thanks. [Next page](https://community.citystrides.com/t/the-trouble-with-trunk-roads/22023.md?page=2)